Events - the case for a cull

[philipcosson]

I would just like to encourage all those non-competitive N12 sailors to give the open circuit a go. It's not always about winning, or even preserving dignity. Our first ever open meeting was at tynemouth - it was the most fun i've ever had in a boat! I would encourage anybody to attend this event if they can possibly do so. Sailing out of the mouth of the tyne into the north sea is something else, and tynemouth priory in the background is quite awe inspiring. Both myself and my crew were/are rank amateurs and the boat was in poor condition really, with lousy sails, but none of that mattered. It is the only time i have ever sailed on the sea and it was a blast!

I have been to open meetings at ripon, scaling, pitsford and tynemouth - each quite different. From my 'rear of the fleet' perspective, a large meeting like northampton gill series is not as fun as the smaller event - i definitely don't feel as involved in the large events. With the smaller events, you do feel part of it, and 10-20 would probably be ideal in my book (10th or 20th dosent sound as bad a 35th or 50th) I do however understand that the club expect numbers to show up because they have cancelled club sailing to put on the event

I'm only likely to do one day events - Northampton is an exception because I have relatives there. I think the most sensible suggestion to come from the thread is to pair up events one for saturday and one for sunday (perhpas the sunday being mixed in with club sailing, and a separate start for the N12's?)
Youth - how about a youth helm only event once a year, 3 races. if we give it a fixture, perhaps the youth will rise to the occasion? if this is too ambitious, perhaps allow adult crews.

Phil

[Chadders]

Good point the youth element Phil but have you read the Hykeham information?  The junior championships is at 16.00hrs on the Saturday.  I agree 100% with your comments and look forward to seeing you at Scaling on Saturday and Hykeham for a day?
Howard C aka Chadders Nvarious

[Phil Brown]

I too spent a thoroughly enjoyable days sailing on Sunday at Desborough at a really friendly club that was delighted to welcome us and which made a determined effort to do so.

To me, the bedrock of a class is its club sailors. I like open meetings, I’ve done a lot of them, but there is much value in maintaining interest in a class without thrashing about on the motorway system to go sailing, never mind the cost. Club sailing is the base of the pyramid on which a class sits.

If the N12 has moved to “touring” class that only sails at open meetings, then we have to accept that fact and that that number of sailors is ever going to be a restricted number with a limited future.

It then moves to a situation where the class has to request a club to hold an open meeting in order to have somewhere to sail and if the numbers aren’t there then neither are the invites from the clubs either.

If, however, a club wishes to devote time and (voluntary) effort in running an open meeting for a fleet that it sails, from a request from its members, then as long as that club understands the number of boats that are likely to attend, then no-one should stand in its way.

Cast your mind back to when you first started sailing, most, like me, cut our teeth on club sailing not being interested in open meetings (never mind not having the budget at that tender age). How do we encourage young sailors into 12s, eg students or graduates leaving university with a hefty overdraft/loan to pay off and who might be tempted into sailing a hi tech, interesting performance boat (such as any of the AC boats currently on the list) for less than a grand?  Not by restricting sailing to open meetings.

To me, its not a cull that’s needed but grass roots support for the benefit of us all.

[philipcosson]

Howard,
unfortunately my sailing season has been completely wiped out due to an achilles tendon tear in january, and a re-rupture in april - so i'm in a plaster cast for another 8 weeks and then gentle rehab - I am looking at october for my next possible open meeting! 

[Tim L (Guest)]

Nice post Phil

Antony,

I’m sorry if I appear a little cynical/sarky:
 
 firstly, simplistic and ill thought out describes most of the reasons given over the years for keeping things as they are and waiting for the dinghy sailing public to realise our true worth…  My favourite being why we needed enourmous championship courses â€" something about if we didn’t then everyone would crash at the windward mark….Quick! Cancel the inlands, cancel Harwich!  It’s just too dangerous…
 
 
Secondly I’m trying to provoke a bit (the internet term may be being a ‘Troll’) to keep the topic turning over and collecting different opinions.  This has been the first decent discussion we’ve had on here for ages and for once it’s not about weight/d*gg*rb*rds.
 
 
Thirdly I’ve been on the committee, midlands rep, a club rep repeatedly, worked at the dinghy show etc etc.  I’ve built up (possibly by accident) club fleets in each place I’ve sailed.  I’ve put in plenty of my own time for the class over the past 8 years.  I’d also consider as a frequent champs/open meeting sailor, being amongst those 20-25 that I feel decisions have been skewed towards.  Therefore I think I’ve got some grounds to question things.
 
 
All the things â€" events, dinghy show, BW organisation are essential to the class and it’s great that we’ve got excellent people organising these things.  However we shouldn’t overlook the fact that away from ‘official’ commitments we have people achieving something potentially very positive for the class. Hykeham/Up River/Spinnaker/Salcombe/Burghfield (present) and Starcross/Bristol/Saltash (recent past) indicate that if enthusiastic and fast (or not so fast in my case) 12 sailors put in time at their local club then successful club fleets can be built up. It’s not unreasonable to take the view that club sailing is a better use of everyones time and resources in growing the class than 3 single digit open turnouts on the same weekend.
 
 
The TVSC open the week before is interesting.  When TVSC has a special event (i.e. 70^th / Gill Series) lots of people attend, it’s a nice place to spend a weekend even if the sailing is a little eccentric.  However plonk it between two other busy weekends and even with no clashes both modern boats and club members were not exactly well represented.  If TVSC was every other year and had one, maybe both, weekends either side free then I suspect it would be a popular event.  Interesting that it’s not really much further than Aldeburgh so if the open circuit can’t be culled due to all these boats in garages around London raring to go to opens then where were they all (G&Z excepted)?  Surely everyone can’t have been busy the same weekend?
 
 
Despise?  Despise is an odd word to associate with an activity as absurd as paying thousands of pounds for a wind powered boat to then tow it all over the country and sail round in circles.  I don’t despise anyone or anything in the class.  I think small opens are a questionable use of slots in the calendar.  A whole world away from despising them.
 
 
Small open turnouts come into the ‘youth’ idea which may be a big red herring in itself.  Think about somebody at uni/just graduated, looking for a 2 person hiker:
 
-If you’ve got some money behind you then you’ll buy a Merlin/200
-If you’re on a restricted budget and you want to be competitive then you’ll be looking at Larks/Fireflies.
 
In neither case is a 12 a rational choice (though fair point that choosing a boat isn’t generally a rational process), it doesn’t carry weight, turnouts are small*, it’s relatively expensive to be competitive, it’s too ‘development’ for most.
 
Switch to considering a parent/child crew and the it looks a lot more sensible.  Lighter and Faster than an Ent/Firefly with excellently priced club level boats that are reasonably competitive at opens.  This is really our ‘public’ and the people we want to consider when arranging our events.
 
But that’s the start of a whole new thread…..
 
 

[Alistair Edwards]

As a recent convert to 12s I view the various Open meetings in my part of the world (Desborough, Ranelagh etc) as ideal future stepping stones for progressing. We have an Open meeting at Twickenham in October and my overall  goal for this season is to be able to participate in this event without embarassing myself too much. Assuming that my 12 sailing is up to scratch I will hopefully then attend Open meetings elsewhere in the Thames region.

The Twickenham Open typically attracts perhaps 8 boats, but we do get some of the top sailors here so clearly they enjoy sailing on the river and think our event is worthwhile.

It is very unlikely that I would attempt to jump from club racing straight to to a major Gill series event. So a cull of small local opens would mean that I never get the chance to progress.

None of our regular club sailors participate in any Open meetings other than the one at Twickenham as they prefer to concentrate on club sailng. I believe that the sight of 3 or 4 12s sailing here twice a week is the key to the growth of the class at TYC.
I am a reasonably good Enterprise helm but after four seasons of always being beaten by 12s in handicap racing I decided I wanted a faster boat! Assuming that I can eventually get to grips with the 12 then there are other possible Enterprise class converts within the club.