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To be really pedantic but to try and clarify this issue . .

It's a basic rule of pulley systems, if you have 15:1 system, to move the load 1 cm, you have to move the other end of the system by 15 cm no matter how you arrange the pulleys and for a 16:1 system . . etc etc

However, as we set these systems up, the limiting factor is when you put in a cascade or even a partial cascade system which is
when you really run out of travel, and I agree with John, the limiting factor is the distance between the base of the mast and the turning block at the shroud plate.

If you take a typical 16:1 system with 2:1 above the deck and a 8:1 cascade to the mast base and assume there is 1000mm between the mast base and the turning block at the deck. The 8:1 has three blocks in the system but I can only pull 2000mm
of rope out until it becomes block to block, The last block below deck has only moved 250mm so the shroud has only moved 125 mm, which doesn't allow the boom to square off very much.

If I now put a 4:1 on the end of a 2:1 below deck with the 2:1 above (still 16:1), I can pull 4000mm of rope before it goes block to block which means that the shroud has now moved 250 mm. So I have double the movement at the shroud but at the  expense of twice the amount of rope round my feet! Not a question of how much purchase there is above the deck but how it
is arranged below deck.

With a 5:1 below deck and a 3:1 above (=15:1) I can move the shroud 330mm but at the expense of 5m of rope
pulled but which probably gives you all the slack you would (ever) want.
 So you would of thought that shroud tracks would have a distinct advantage, if only in the amount of rope to be shifted at the corners.

I've gone for a 5:1 and 3:1 system without using the full potential of travel but if I find I'm winding in arm fulls of rope at the bottom mark, I might go tracks yet.

If you have a cascade kicking strap system and find you're running out of travel, same principle applies, try replacing the last block of the cascade with a 4:1 instead of a 2:1 system

For the record

The pantomime is Aladdin, performed by our village panto group last week in the village hall. This year we had a record total audience of 431 (not bad considering the village consists of approx 1600) and a HUGE amount of fun was had in rehearsal and performance by everyone involved.

BTW, Simon has been relegated to prompt on the grounds that he could never remember his lines, in particular when as dame himself in Robinson Crusoe he just couldn't get the 'mop' scene right, despite a prompt on+ both sides of the stage and a great deal of rehearsal. As for poor wife and kids, lightweight no-wind crew made a star debut in the junior chorus, and heavy weather crew wanted to take part but couldn't because she had to babysit middle crew who wouldn't take part even if you bought him a new boat!

And if I'm suspended, can I have my subs back?

You're behind me!!

Or how about a not so scruffy Design 8 ? - 3398 is up for sale.

Get well soon

Afraid so, just had an email from Kevan
"

   Dear All

I am sorry to announce that Alverbank Sails has
ceased trading due to both economic reasons and problems with the tenure of our
lease.
I am approaching 65 and have decided to back
out.
I must thank everybody for their support over years
and will miss the gossip when cutomers come in for a chat.
 
Stuart who has worked with for this year will start
up in his own name and will hopefully be able to offer the same services will be
contactable on 07855 946527
 
Kevan Bloor
Alverbank Sails Ltd"


I'm sure we all wish Kevan a long and happy retirement

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Well said Jane

Having a top helm or crew at the front of the boat is invaluable in terms of advice but the finesse and therefore the ability to get the boat going properly is still down to the helm. No amount of chatter into a helms port and starboard ear'oles is going to make a huge amount of difference to that which comes from time on the water learning the skills.

What a good crew can and should be doing all the time is to give confidence to the helm (they can be a bit precious sometimes), provide positive feedback, keep an eye on boat set up, check on other boats positions, check the tactics being employed agree with the race stategy you agreed on before the start (you did have one, didn't you?) keep an eye on wind direction and keep the helm (quietly) updated on headers or lifts, plan ahead for mark roundings, keep the boat and sails trimmed and balanced. The crew can have a wider brief than the helm and all that can leave the helm to concentrate on driving the boat hard - which is his/her job - it's all about speed. The more responsibility for race decisions that a crew can take on, the less time the helm has to worry/think about all the other issues and can concentrate for longer. Nobody said crewing was easy or just pulling on a jib sheet.


Back to this thread. Not every teenager can afford a decent boat. I got my experience by helming in the regular club crews race, at first with the boat owner, then, as he got more confidence in me, with anyone who would crew for me. That then lead on to confidence, on both sides, to borrow boats for open meetings. I would be more prepared to lend my boat if I had first hand knowledge of demonstrated ability and if others felt the same, you might have more participants in the series


I think you overplay the good helm factor. They are more used to receiving information than to giving it and you might find a better performance comes from having a good crew at the front

Well done Paul, I think that says it all

Didn't know my chequebook could get me a crew? I normally get pestered for hardware!


I agree with OMSC. I think Junior/Crews races at open meetings or club sailing for that matter are a great idea. I'm not sure the idea should be dismissed out of hand

Speaking as a one time fully paid up member of the Crews Union, I will say that the crew is hugely important and, as we know, helms can't do without us. Speaking a parent, I know that Ben and Alex would much rather sail with their peers and not their father who would be telling them what to do all the time (that's their take on it anyway) But, if you are trying to get a series together, it just might be helpful if an experienced crew was there to introduce the newcomers to open meetings, you could always restrict the number of races sailed with an old crew (and we'd promise to go to bed early so as not to spoil the party).

Good luck with the series

Antony

If everything was down to price alone, then life would be very much simpler. Out of curiosity, I did the same calculation the other day on the DCB as Martin did and, like he, drew breath. I haven't spoken to Paul recently but he is pretty efficient at producing boats, so maybe that is where the difference lies. Anyway, this is one of the attractions of the class that we can have a variety of designs and construction that can produce boats with similar performance.


As for Pandora's Box's comment, my boat wasn't built by Rondar so I'm not going to spring to their defence but there are not many boat builders that haven't had production "opportunities" over the years.

So what if any of the builders produce a budget boat that might not be worth as much in 5 years time? They are bought cheaper and sold cheaper, so the depeciation is probably the same for the first owner. From all the comments we see and hear, the market is crying out for reasonably priced, second hand, modern design, DB boats. That can only be a good thing for the class as a whole. We may all want to drive around in BMW's or whatever, but not all of us can afford them (or aspire to them) and are quite happy in a Mondeo. The builders should be commended for supporting the class and producing cost effective boats.



But all that misses the point. For all the variety, what the boat builders cannot supply is the nut that goes on the end of the tiller and I believe that that, at the end of the day, is what makes the real difference. Will the owner of the next DCB produce 6 wins at Burton Week? It's a truism in nearly all classes that the vast majority of the fleet are sailing a boat that is faster than the crew is, even if the boat was set up properly. It probably applies to N12s as well, although we do have a remarkable pool of talent, anyway, I know I fit that category.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder but I agree with Mike that we may be at a turning point. Next season could be very interesting.

Don't know if the prices have changed but Rondar's Dinghy Show price for a P2 to include full race spec, adjustable T foil rudder, sails, covers, combi and VAT was £8500. That could be a one off price but if you take out the carbon and trim tab options it's still a good deal against the CB and FF

As my PC won't let me make any further updates to the advert, please call or email for recent photos now available.

See Boats for Sale for contact details

La Rochelle SC has superb facilities and the old town has a fantastic selection of restaurants specialising in fruit de mers, big thumbs up!

Alternatives for the planners to consider though are on the south coast of Brittany, Loctudy at the west (brilliant langoustines, right on the edge of the Atlantic but can have St Michael's Mount's problem if relying on sea breezes), Quiberon/Carnac (bit like sailing in Portland Harbour but more open) and La Baule, (more a resort), all excellent and with camping and beaches a bit nearer.

It doesn't sound as if it's the bond between coatings thats breaking down as it's getting through to the wood

Epifanes Clear Varnish should be fine over 2 pack, see below for the product sheet from Marineware


http://www.marineware.com/pdf/epifanes/MW_Epifanes_2_1_ClearGlossVarnish.pdf

If you use oxalic acid, neutralise with bicarbonate of soda ( or baking soda) and wash well before coating