Messages

I have a mast from a Crusader, apparently.  I bought by mistake, too short for my starfish - deeper cockpit.
yours for £50.  If you need it.
Cheers

Historically, when the class was originally started there was a limit on how much that could be spent on a boat.  A noble idea, that was never going to work for all sorts of practical reasons, reading from Robin Stevenson's books.  But is this the issue?  Currently the modern National 12 is beyond what most people can or want to afford.  And it would seem that now, a professional build is the only answer(?) for these new boats, built with these exotic materials.  Whatever the external pressures are, a new boat is out of reach for most.  This has always been the case, with any class.  But, perhaps, more so now.  Whether it is the pace of developement that is the culprit, or lack of disposable income.  Or the proliferation of other classes, that might promise the same thrills for less outlay?  Or the current fashion for Asymetrics?
Perhaps, all that is needed to is to embrace the whole class as it stands today.  As is already being done in the vintage/classic fleet?  And instead of discarding the olders designs, keep them racing.  Fleets could be age related.....50s, 60s, 70s, 80s......This is probably not a new idea....

Or perhaps people are just generally reluctant to commit to the major expense of buying a new boat in the current financial climate?  How many people actually feel that secure in thier current jobs that they can/want to commit to a new boat.  This is a hobby after all......

So, what we are saying is, you have a dinghy class, made up of many designs (over the years). 
The success of each design seems to be measured on its ability to win one race in one particular type of venue. 
If this was not achieved, that particular design was deemed a failure, or at the very least, not to represent a worthwhile step in the right direction.  The 'right direction' has seen the boat become wider, shallower and more powerful in open water?  It has seen it go from, wood on frame clinker to glued clinker, to 4 plank, to fibreglass, to cold molded, to frp, double bottomed, carbon fibre, etc.
Also as technology has been developed and embraced, the cost and complexity of the craft has increased to the point whereby new people are put off?
So the modern designs are now about as far removed from the 'general purposefulness' of the original Uffa king as it can be.  And this has been going on right from the word "go" ?
When you have a boat that is continually developed for just one task to the detriment of all others, over many decades, you will end up with a boat that is so focused for that task, that it can do nothing else.  It will also now apeal to only a few sailors of a like mind, who are in it for a chance to win......'The race'.  You put racers in charge of a class, you will eventually get a race boat and only a race boat.
What of the rest of the fleet?....Have they retired from the arms race, to potter around in their 'non-competive old boat' at thier local club?  Join the vintage fleet?  CVRDA?
I am not a 'died in the wool' racer, but I love my two N12s.  But one is a classic Starfish and the other is a vintage Holt design and I sail them inland, on a lake.  Unfortunatley, I am never likely to go sea to try and win the Burton Cup.  So these old designs, especially the Starfish, offer someone like me, a good compromise.  A boat that is lively, cheap and low tech, that I can manitain myself with a pot of traditional varnish and a bit of time.
So, is the class dead because no new boats have been made?  Probably not.  But are many people are looking at the older boat designs instead of buying new?
Cheers

Anything from the local hardware store or B&Q and the like, is not going to be hard wearing enough for painting a boats.
Modern exterior paints are now far too soft and entirely useless for boats, even if they are for fresh water use only.  Although in 'days gone by' I have painted boats with normal gloss paint.  But that was some years ago.
So you have to pay your money and get some proper marine paint.  Last stuff I used from from a firm called Hempel, I think.  But none of them are cheap.
I did not take it all the way back to wood, as the paint underneath was only faded and not extensively damaged.  I used a roller to apply the paint, which was good enough for my needs.
I would recomend looking to the Classic and Vintage Racing Dinghy Association website (CVRDA) as they have some useful guides on painting and varnishing.
Good luck

I would leave the orbital sander in its box.  Much damage has been done with them.  There are sanders that are much better for the job though, I will let someone else pipe up with recommendations. 
Heat and chemical stripper is normal.
Here is a link to some info from the CVRDA - Classic and Vintage Racing Dinghy Association.
If that does not work put this in:
http://www.cvrda.org/wp-cvrda/
Basically, the harder the stuff is that has been put on in the first place, the harder it will be to get it off.
If it has lifted, its coming off.  A patch repair might keep you afloat, but it will look unsightly.
Cheers
Steve H

Try again

Chris and I checking out Sparkle with new (for us) mast.

I have a similar set of pulleys mounted on Planet but used to help pull the steel centre pate up. 
Sparkle also only has bouyancy bags at the back.  Unfortunately I popped one recently when I blew it up on a cold day......Next day was hot and it went pop.   Lesson learned...Doh!
Should of taken a pictue though
Cheers
Steve Hawkins

The old Bat Jib I have was last measured in 1987 and seems to be close to the numbers mentioned above.
I did do the 45% / 50% measurements and marked the sail appropriately.  And it would seem that I am petty close to be spot on.
This does not suprise me too much as the previous setup used fairleads mounted on the seats, either side.  The jib sheet passed very close to the aft edge of the fore deck, so when I mounted the rail, it effectively intercepted that line but a bit further up.  So I will leave it as it is for the time being - I will give it some more consideration when I redeck her...eventually.
I probably get away with it on Sparkle, as the fordeck might well extend slightly further aft than later designs?
Thanks for the info though.
Cheers
Steve H

Thanks chaps,
Better go an get the tape measure out.
Looks like it was wrong on Pendle Witch (Starfish) and I have copied the mistake across to Sparkle....Doh!
Cheers
Steve Hawkins.

I was reading my copy of Robin Steavenson's National 12 book, when I came across a couple of statements pertaining to the Noakes Starfish design.
1.  The designer (Mr Noakes) is recorded as recomending a 25/65 ratio for jib/main setup.  Is this still relevent after all these years?  What are peoples current thoughts especially with the advent of loose foot mains/spreaders/etc?  I am running a second hand mismatched set of sails and after a very recent thread I am going to have to have a look at the combination I have - just to see if; a.  It is likely to be legal.  b.  If it is a recomended configuration for the design.  The current main is the only loose foot main I am in possession of and the jib, is the best of a pile, but is certainly bigger that some of the older ones I have.  Looking down the line, having updated my mast, I hope to be looking at sourcing a new set - once I can come to terms with paying more than double the price I paid for the boat/trailer/etc for them. 
2.  Mr Steavenson describes a sliding jib fairlead arrangement on the trailing edge of the foredeck.  I saw something similar on Pendle Witch and have replicated it on Sparkle, Or at least I think I have.  On Sparkle, as you pull the jib in tighter, from the oposite side of the boat, which is where the crew is likely to be when close hauled, the fairlead and cleat will move inboard on the track.  When the tension is released the slider will return outboard - this is controlled by shock cord under the deck.  Mr Steavenson describes the action completely the opposite - i.e. when the tension is released, the cleat and fair lead returns inboard?  Seems a bit odd?
Cheers
Steve Hawkins

I acquired the Lark.  Stripped it of spares.  Sold some spares that covered the cost of the original purchase.  Dumped the hull - only suitable for a planter. 
The Lark mast only needed the new bands painted on, the goose neck moving and the shrouds remounted - I used the stainless steel chain plates off the lark riveted to the mast to attach the shrouds.
I sailed it today.  All seems well.
The spreaders are mounted lower than seems to be the norm with N12s, but I am not sure it will make much difference - so I did not move them.
So I have a older 60's type Proctor C section mast with a single diamond up for grabs as well as a later, shorter mast, possibly of a Crusader (6480mm length).
Cheers

It would seem that the old mast is in fact a very old Proctor C.
It used to have a wheeled kicker, and still has a diamond plus a lot complication around the slot at the lower part of the mast. It is however considerably thicker above the hounds than the newer mast I have aquired.  Probably due to the way the sheave is mounted at the top.  Makes it look beefier than its more modern counterparts - which is probably what had me fooled.
The newer mast, the sheave for the main halyard is a part of the top mast fitting.
So I could just transfer the spreaders across.  After removing the Diamond, etc.
To complicate maters, I have just been offered an abandoned Lark (Parker 1900 and something) to strip and dispose of, for a donation to club funds - not my club, but another one local (they have another as well).  It comes with a straight Proctor C mast, of very similar dimentions to my original - with adjustable spreaders, etc.  The distance from the base of the mast to the 'for triangle height' on the Lark mast is exactly the same as that on my original N12 mast.  In theory, I would only have to move the top band down by 7 cm and the boom mount up by 9cm and Bob is your mother's brother.  plus I get a bucket full of stainless doodads for the trouble.  Oh and I have to take the old hull to the tip.....
I will have to give it some thought.
Cheers
Steve H

Just wanted a more modern, lighter, mast with Spreaders, rather than a diamond.
Although I am just bringing a late 60s boat into the 70s.
But you are right, its a hassle, more hassle than I originally envisioned.
But it has been done before.
Cheers
Steve