History of the National 12s

[nigelf]

Would any kind possessor of a redundant copy of Robin Steavenson's "History of the National 12s" be prepared to sell it to me? I had his "When Dinghies Delight" and "Marks to Starboard" when a youngster, both of which iI lent to friends who failed to return them but I gather the History is out of print. Any reasonable price plus postage willingly paid. N3535.

[Chadders]

Hi sorry I cant help with the history although much of it is covered in the class handbook.  A few years ago Howard Steavenson had a reprint of When Dingies Delight printed and he may well still have some, his number is in the book I think.  Good hunting. Howard

[Interested Party]

They can be sourced from Amazon.  I have just bought a copy of each.  Each for the price of a couple of beers.
Thanks for drawing them to my attention.
I recently purchased When Dinghies Delight and 'Sailing on Small Waters'. 

[edwillett]

Yes, original copies of all Robin's books currently available very cheaply on Amazon...

[nigelf]

Thanks everyone. I have ordered a copy from Amazon. The book is of course The Story, not The History-my mistake. I never met Robin Steavenson but in my young days he was a key man in the development and the spread of the class. Shortly after the glued clinker boats were authorised several came to my then club in Scotland including a Proctor Mk.2 just like Robin's "Witchcraft" pictured in the Class Handbook. It was the most gorgeous boat I had ever seen - no nails and no ribs unlike my own Holt designed and built N1149. I don't know just how well the glues of those days are holding up but the boats looked as though they would last for ever. I recall, I hope correctly, that two glued boats were given certificates (Robin's and Geoff Keene's) and that the new building form was authorised shortly after it was clear that the boats were solidly built (as Dick Wyche had always said they would be). I wonder if it might have been a good idea to have authorised, say, two boats to race with foiling rudders before giving the class the all-clear. The glued clinker boats were never going to outclass those which had gone before. Can we say the same about foiling rudders? Only an idle thought! N3535.
!

[edwillett]

Where were you based in Scotland?

[MikeDay]

'The glued clinker boats were never going to outclass those which had gone before.' - Surely, history tells us otherwise, since the ribbed boats were heavier, leaked and were of a construction form that would not have allowed the wider 1960s designs to emerge.  Trial changes to rules allowed us to experiment, for example, with 4-plank construction in the 1950s (Foursquare, which was rejected, probably unwisely) and in the late 1960s with Impact (when it was agreed).  However, lots of Twelve developments have happened because someone had a bright idea that wasn't excluded by the rules at the time.  That's the point about winged rudders - one or two people experimented with them ten or so years ago and we all decided they didn't work.  However, when Jo Richards, Dave Peacock and John Meadowcroft worked out various ways of adjusting the angle of attack while sailing, it all fell in to place.
 
Mike D
N3533 

[nigelf]

Ed. I was a member of the Holy Loch club from 1954-56 where we had a very good quality N12 fleet which included both Richard Roscoe and Peter Collyer, respectively Points Cup winner at Torquay in 1960 and 4th in the Points Cup at Westcliff in 1954. I moved to the Edinburgh area in 1960, sailed for many years on Loch Lomond (Clyde Canoe Club in those days), then at Dalgety Bay, in a variety of boats but unfortunately there was no local interest in the N12. I was at Barnton latterly, just along the road from you! I am now near family in Kent and a member at Chipstead SC. My wife and I will be at Hayling Island in June as spectators and dinner attendees- any chance of you being there? Nigel Fordyce. N3535.

[nigelf]

Mike. I agree totally with your comments. What I was trying to say, perhaps not clearly enough, was that the change to glued clinker construction did not in itself, at the time, outclass the existing boats. Obviously the new construction method opened the door to all manner of ideas, but they were questions of performance, not strength of construction which was the issue back around 1952. Many clever and innovative people have made lasting contributions to the class but have any had the effect of outclassing  the performance  of existing boats in the way foiling rudders have done? From what I read, the Gill Series now recognises the foiling boats as a "seperate" category which i assume implies that they are so superior that they require that recognition. How many of the entries at Hayling Island will have a serious chance of competing with the best? Without the foiling rudders I would suggest that at least all the Feeling Foolishes, the Final Chapters, the Numinouses and a few others would be serious competitors, It was in that context that i was comparing the trialling of a couple of boats in the early 1950s with the current situation.Nigel.

[edwillett]

Hi Nigel
I suspected the Holy Loch connection! Clyde Canoe Club is still going strong.....
I have my eye on Hayling Island but attendance will depend partly on work, and partly on the forecast nearer the time!! Hopefully be there...

[MikeDay]

Nigel - without wishing unduly to prolong this exchange, the great thing about foiling rudders is that it's relatively easy to retro-fit them to earlier designs and to get a significant performance improvement.  Some Foolishes and Chapters have been modified to great effect.  So, rather than outclassing the earlier designs, foiling rudders are an inclusive devlopment.  I do appreciate that the cost is not cheap but then you don't get much change from £1000 for a new suit of sails. 
 
Mike D
N3533